What Do You Believe In?

What Do You Believe In?

  • Islam

    Votes: 1 5.0%
  • Hindu

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Buddhist

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Christianity

    Votes: 5 25.0%
  • Naturalism

    Votes: 1 5.0%
  • Mysticism

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Socialist

    Votes: 2 10.0%
  • Democratic

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Nationalist

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • Other

    Votes: 11 55.0%

  • Total voters
    20
I believe in the love of a good woman and Pasta, truly, it's all you need to succeed in life.

Robin Williams joke: When you die you wake up and you find yourself strapped to a barber's chair. A angel asks you what is the one true religion, you reply Christianity. Angel shakes his head and says, no, Mormonism. you reply, but I have a Osmonds' record. Then you fall into the pit of Hell for all Eternity.

It may not be relevant but it makes me laugh.


Lol, I do like such jokes (believe it or not)

I will say, though, that from my own understanding of scriptures God is more just and fair and merciful than that: for God judges us not just by belief, but by our knowledge and our intentions, and that is something wonderful. We're not punished for our lack of knowledge, but rather handled carefully and appropriately. Imagine, if you will, someone who never once heard the word of Christ Jesus in their lives. Do they go to hell? Of course not. They are judged by what they know. :thumb: Same goes for infants and children and the mentally challenged. For me, that is proof positive of a merciful God.
 
I am a follower of the religion of Nihilism, and none of you matter. None of you, including me.


Ahhh.... the zero theorem.... everything adds up to nothing, and nothing matters, and no one matters.

In effect, naturalism and materialism and atheism (or extension of it).

Where there is no ultimate justice for anyone. Where there is no rhyme or reason to our lives. There is no purpose. There is no meaning to anything what so ever. There is no good or evil. There is no values to anything or anyone. Our lives, our accomplishements, etc. are all equal to the single celled amobea (or even less). The serial killer is the same as the good citizen. The genocidal dictator who kills millions, is the same as a good samaritan. Etc, etc etc.

And since we're just the creations of chaos from a mindless, unguided process and nothing more: one must wonder can you really trust your own brain to come to such grand conclusions? :thumb: let me put it in another perspective: if your computer was created through a blind, unguided process, would you trust it? No you would not. So why do you diminish your own self by assuming you were the result of the same process?

Anyways, I digress. You could easily say to me, "So what? Just because you want something to be true doesn't mean it is true," and you would be correct: but so, too, is the mindset that "Just because you don't want it to be true, doesn't mean that it isn't true." Therefore, we must come down to the evidence: direct, indirect, cir***stancial, etc. etc. etc. of whether or not all of our morals and values and purpose (ultimately) is the result of chance, or the result of a plan (design).

Also, something for you to consider.... something that T.S. Eliot said a century or so ago.....

?It is in Christianity that our arts have developed; it is in Christianity that the laws of Europe--until recently--have been rooted. It is against a background of Christianity that all of our thought has significance. An individual European may not believe that the Christian faith is true, and yet what he says, and makes, and does will all spring out of his heritage of Christian culture and depend upon that culture for its meaning...I do not believe that culture of Europe could survive the complete disappearance of the Christian faith. And I am convinced of that, not merely because I am a Christian myself, but as a student of social biology. If Christianity goes, the whole culture goes.?

The greatest irony of our world.... that no matter what belief or worldview you perscribe to.... ultimately stems from an originality that has permeated the world culture for two thousand years.... all our laws, all our moral codes and ethics and values.... all come from this belief system (ultimately) so therefore when one states "I am a moral atheist," "I am a moral naturalist", "I am a moral humanist", "I am a moral nihilist", etc etc etc..... the very things you state to be morals, values, etc. are based upon the very things you rally so hard against.

The ultimate question, should be: "Are my thoughts, opinions, sentiments, feelings, ultimately of my own discovery or because of indoctrination in all facets of culture?" because every single fabric of our society, regardless of nationality and geographic location and gender and race has been raised to follow certain codes of conduct based from this singularity (origin). The onlly way one could ever be a "true atheist" or "true nihilist", etc. is if one figures out (or creates) their own code of conduct and laws to follow that have no relation to the culture around them---- or unless they can ultimately prove that such morals, values, etc. are manmade and not from design.

And I can assure you, that even in our 21st century world the answer of where morals comes from, where consciousness and mind comes from, etc. has YET to be answered. As one of the world's leading scientists Dean Hamer, molecular biologist & geneticist from the National Institute of Heath & the Sundance Institute, has said (and I quote) "I cannot tell you molecularly or chemically what a thought is. I cannot tell you physically what a memory is." Where did we get information from? How do we understand what is information and what isn't? Etc etc etc. There is no naturalistic answer to the question, and even someone like Richard Dawkins has not been able to give a satisfactory answer to the problem---- without first interjecting an agency (algorithmic mechanism) to make his own theories work, which goes against the complete understanding of "blind, unguided processes".
 
I only believe in and have always believed in Sex, Drugs and Rock n Roll , oh and as I have aged throw in food and football. Do not and never have believed in heaven, hell, God or the Christian concept of God. I believe in science and things which are proved beyond a doubt. You have one life, existence, there is no life after death, life has no meaning other than if you waste your time and refuse to enjoy life you just missed out on your only chance.
 
I only believe in and have always believed in Sex, Drugs and Rock n Roll , oh and as I have aged throw in food and football. Do not and never have believed in heaven, hell, God or the Christian concept of God. I believe in science and things which are proved beyond a doubt. You have one life, existence, there is no life after death, life has no meaning other than if you waste your time and refuse to enjoy life you just missed out on your only chance.


Alot of the things that you state are "proven" in fact are not remotely close to being proven: God, afterlife, or even the notion that all things are answerable by science. The irony is that there is no universal consensus in science about virtually every facet of life and observation, in all fields of science. People are usually under the belief or assumption that because a theory is released in the news, doesn't mean that it is accepted by the majority of scientists. Also, most people do not realize that statements from scientists, are not always statements of science: nonsense remains nonsense no matter who says it.

That's why I like someone like Bill Nye who will say "I am skeptical but open minded," because even he will acknowledge that the so called answers (presumably answered already by science) have not been answered. Science is supposed to be unbiased and indifferent to opinion, and yet we have many scientists---- atheists and theists alike---- who are biased in their worldviews, and try to force science to fit into their perceptions: when it should be the reverse, that one should try and fit their worldview into science and see if it stands up to scrutiny.

As Arthur C. Clarke once said, "A faith that cannot withstand collision with the truth: is not worth many regrets," and the same is applied to atheism as well as the conceptions of religion and spirituality.
 
I don't understand why the poll is whether you 'believe' in politics or religions. It's like saying that socialism is a religion and Christianity is politics :dontknow:
 
I don't understand why the poll is whether you 'believe' in politics or religions. It's like saying that socialism is a religion and Christianity is politics :dontknow:


One can argue that the two are mutually exclusive to one another..... Think William Shakespeare, for instance, in his Tragedy of Richard III where the Duke of Buckingham declares (in front of the populous) how upstanding and loyal and humble the Regent (R3) was all because he was holding a "book of prayer in his hands", and also of modern day monarchies and even Presidential elections where it's almost always cited "the divine right of kings", because God is ultimately in control of fate.

This is nothing new, and isn't just a Christian or Islamic or Judaic ideology either: as we seen in Greece, Rome, Egypt, etc. that positions of righteousness in accordance to one's religious convictions were qualifiers for public office of any position. Then again, we are talking about a time in which theology/philosophy, the arts, and government were mandatory courses in the school systems---- and still are to this day: I know of no college that doesn't have some sort of required philsophy class as part of their semester schedule.

As for why the poll was set up that way.... generally speaking, there are people who are 'agnostic' or flat out 'atheist' or even 'theist' who ascribe to a socialist, communist, etc. mindset and while I personally do not know how one can declare themselves as such and yet be believers in God when such doctrines were founded on naturalism and racial superiority based on Darwinism.... I suppose one can look at one's own political views as something "religious" who are all about party agenda. :dontknow: Guess this is their platform to explain why they believe the way they do, as this is meant to help share ideas and evoke thought.
 
RUFUS, either your knowledge of colleges and majors is extremely limited, or you just like making generalizations without any supporting evidence.

Behold:
ECU Requirements for a MM in Music Ed
ECU Req's for a MA in History
ECU Req's for a BS/BA in History

I was just looking for your philosophy class, that's all?

Do you know why Presidents swear on the Bible when they take their oath of office? Hint: it has nothing to do with religion. Hint: it has nothing to do with the law. It's literally because "that's how it's always been done." Tradition. That's it. And, not all US Presidents have sworn on a Bible. John Adams took his oath on a book of law. Teddy Roosevelt didn't use a book at all the first time (although he did opt for a Bible the second time around). Lyndon Johnson took his on a Catholic missal. Which if you don't know, is literally just the instructions for Mass throughout the year.

Also, "So Help me God" added at the end is not part of the actual oath, was added by Chester A. Arthur when he took it, and is generally accepted at the end by current US Presidents. Again... for tradition.

"In God We Trust" on your US currency? Anti-communism propaganda from the Cold War.

Religion is one scale. Politics are another. Period. They shouldn't cross, but they do. Being an humanitarian, wanting people to have access to healthcare and education so that they can better themselves (and ultimately the country) has NOTHING to do with Religion. Nothing. Zip. Nada. Zilch.
 
RUFUS, either your knowledge of colleges and majors is extremely limited, or you just like making generalizations without any supporting evidence.

Behold:
ECU Requirements for a MM in Music Ed
ECU Req's for a MA in History
ECU Req's for a BS/BA in History

I was just looking for your philosophy class, that's all?

Do you know why Presidents swear on the Bible when they take their oath of office? Hint: it has nothing to do with religion. Hint: it has nothing to do with the law. It's literally because "that's how it's always been done." Tradition. That's it. And, not all US Presidents have sworn on a Bible. John Adams took his oath on a book of law. Teddy Roosevelt didn't use a book at all the first time (although he did opt for a Bible the second time around). Lyndon Johnson took his on a Catholic missal. Which if you don't know, is literally just the instructions for Mass throughout the year.

Also, "So Help me God" added at the end is not part of the actual oath, was added by Chester A. Arthur when he took it, and is generally accepted at the end by current US Presidents. Again... for tradition.

"In God We Trust" on your US currency? Anti-communism propaganda from the Cold War.

Religion is one scale. Politics are another. Period. They shouldn't cross, but they do. Being an humanitarian, wanting people to have access to healthcare and education so that they can better themselves (and ultimately the country) has NOTHING to do with Religion. Nothing. Zip. Nada. Zilch.

Mind you I said theology/philosophy.... and that can apply to Greek Philosophy, etc. along with Antiquities considering such men as Aristotle, Socrates, Xenophanes, Plato, etc. are required reading in such courses and they (more or less) were the initiators of such doctrines and methodologies. Alot of colleges here in the states and overseas, have always followed a certain system which stems from the Greeks and Romans which was: Government, History, Philosophy, the Arts, and the Sciences. You couldn't have a grounded education, in their minds, without the inclusion of spiritual discussion.

As for my own country's history as to religion and requirements for political office, etc. I suppose it depends on which Founding Father you prefer to listen to and follow. Jefferson was a deist, as was Franklin, and Adams: yet if you were to talk to someone like Patrick Henry he would say that our country could not exist as it is without the principles of Christianity and the acknowledgement that our rights are not only God given, but were of the Judea-Christian God. Virtually all the Founders, regardless of personal views, all were in agreement (however) that the most perfect doctrine ever made was the teachings of Jesus Christ.

That being said, though, you may have heard the statement "There will be no religious test" for holding political office in the United States, and while that is true for FEDERAL offices that does not apply to the states. Arkansas, Texas, Maryland, Mississippi, North Carolina, Pennsylvania, South Carolina and Tennessee have "religious tests" to hold office in those states. However, one can argue that those (if challenged) could be deemed unconstitutional---- though one must bare in mind that in our country you have a greater chance at electing a Muslim, Mormon, etc to office than you would a devout atheist: even President Obama made this remark on the Bill Maher Show a few months ago and this is reflective of the culture in America where over 80% of the country is either Christian or believes in some sort of spirituality.

The same measure can also be applied to the United Kingdom in many ways, as over 60% of the country is either Christian or believes in some sort of spirituality and the principle figurehead of the nation (the Crown) is also the head of the Church of England, which so happens to be a Christian denomination and the national anthem is "God Save the Queen", and several Prime Ministers over the decades have stated that Britian (despite any popular opinion) is indeed a Christian nation. The only difference between America and our British cousins is that we did not factor religion (or more apt, any certain denomination) into a government position.
 
RUFUS - you specifically said CLASS, not "required reading" as a part of one of those CLASSES. So there in again, my point stands. And do you know why the Queen is the head of the Church of England? Because the King's power comes from God... Or so they say. So therein again, Tradition. And per the usual, you've posted a long winded post that literally says nothing. Yes, I'm quite aware that several states have such laws, but if they were challenged, they're quite unconstitutional, and down right discriminatory.

Those are specifically: Arkansas, Maryland, Mississippi, North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee, and Texas. Arkansas's law, which reads "No person who denies the being of a God shall hold any office in the civil departments of this State, nor be competent to testify as a witness in any Court." is quite interesting. I wonder how many people have gotten out of a court appearance because of that? Because I'd totally be using the hell out of that.

Mississippi and South Carolina's are quite similar saying "No person who denies the existence of a Supreme Being shall hold any office in this state (Miss)". Which it doesn't exactly say which supreme being.

I won't even get into the stupidity that is Texas's version of this backwards law. But while we're on the subject of stupid laws that are still on the books, in North Carolina, it's against the law to sing off key. It's also against the law for Elephants to plow cotton fields. My personal favorite is that you're not allowed to serve alcohol at a bingo game. What kind of lit bingo games that they think happens?

And... above all else... IF you would have bothered to read what I wrote before rambling on, you would have noticed that I said "Religion is one scale. Politics are another. Period. They shouldn't cross, but they do." READ WHAT PEOPLE WRITE BEFORE YOU RESPOND
 
RUFUS - you specifically said CLASS, not "required reading" as a part of one of those CLASSES. So there in again, my point stands. And do you know why the Queen is the head of the Church of England? Because the King's power comes from God... Or so they say. So therein again, Tradition. And per the usual, you've posted a long winded post that literally says nothing. Yes, I'm quite aware that several states have such laws, but if they were challenged, they're quite unconstitutional, and down right discriminatory.

Those are specifically: Arkansas, Maryland, Mississippi, North Carolina, South Carolina, Tennessee, and Texas. Arkansas's law, which reads "No person who denies the being of a God shall hold any office in the civil departments of this State, nor be competent to testify as a witness in any Court." is quite interesting. I wonder how many people have gotten out of a court appearance because of that? Because I'd totally be using the hell out of that.

Mississippi and South Carolina's are quite similar saying "No person who denies the existence of a Supreme Being shall hold any office in this state (Miss)". Which it doesn't exactly say which supreme being.

I won't even get into the stupidity that is Texas's version of this backwards law. But while we're on the subject of stupid laws that are still on the books, in North Carolina, it's against the law to sing off key. It's also against the law for Elephants to plow cotton fields. My personal favorite is that you're not allowed to serve alcohol at a bingo game. What kind of lit bingo games that they think happens?

And... above all else... IF you would have bothered to read what I wrote before rambling on, you would have noticed that I said "Religion is one scale. Politics are another. Period. They shouldn't cross, but they do." READ WHAT PEOPLE WRITE BEFORE YOU RESPOND


1) If something is part of the required reading of a class, then one must assume the class in question has MUCH to do with the subject matter at hand that you are required to read. That's a given. So I stand by what I stated the first time: and besides there are indeed classes on Philosophy, Theology, etc. in colleges and in many they are required courses to take.

2) Whether they are discriminatory or not depends upon the will of the people (more or less) and considering that they have NOT been challenged, is a testament to public opinion in those states (and to the nation at large) because many do believe our nation is founded (at least in part) on such Judeao-Christian principles and most simply will not elect those into office who are not of a religious persuasion or one who would threaten their liberties---- and as we have seen greatly in the last decade, there are so many groups out there who have been rather forceful in their atheism and "equality in name only" rhetoric, which has caused much division among the majority and the minority which only solidifies solidarity against those who go against traditions.

3) Lol, yes I will agree there are many laws on the books that are simply ignorant and intolerably stupid. Matter of fact, there is a town not far from where I live (DeGraff, Ohio) which still has a law on the books from the 1880's which states one cannot spit on the sidewalk. Also (though another subject entirely) the number of laws on the books in America is unknown: believe it or not there are over 20,000 laws just on gun ownership. Chances are, if you are a gun owner, you are probably breaking a law and not even realize it. Most of the legislation is meaningless (and I'm speaking in a generalized sense across the board) so in that we are in agreement.

4) I did read what you said, but you made so many points I felt compelled to comment on them. I'm not a mind reader :lmao: if you didn't want me to comment on certain things, you should have made that clear from the start. And yes, I am quite aware, that there is no real clarification made when it comes to "supreme being", however the Founding Father's made it quite clear the characteristics of that supreme being (God) and cites that He was the Creator of all things and that all rights (life, liberty, pursuit of happiness) are God given.

Maybe Charles Krauthammer said it best in one of his articles that the reason why this was instituted to begin with was because the Founder's knew that if such freedoms and rights were given by government, they were subject to change. However, if applied to God it could not be challenged because God is something/someone who cannot be questioned: namely because if one says the attributes of God are such, and all are in uniform agreement of this (the Founders) then our do***ents containing our freedoms cannot be overruled because atheist and believer alike attributed such qualities to a just God.

Or as Krauthammer further elaborated, "the nations that believe in nothing are also capable of anything," citing atheistic China and Russia during the first, second and cold wars. As he pointed out, even if God doesn't exist, it is necessary to say that God does exist in order to maintain some sort of moral compass and orderly structure to society: and there is a factual basis in this, as there are in depth studies of crime being less in areas where religious churches, symbols, etc. are erected in America and the United Kingdom. As if God Himself encites conscience in the would be criminal.
 
1) Stop back peddling. You said, you couldn't think of a college where the COURSE was not required to graduate.
2) No, it depends on the will of the candidates, they remain unchallenged because a candidate has not put forth the money and the effort to challenge them. Also, the Bible belt is a thing.
3) Laws are only as effective as far as they can be enforced.
4) No, you didn't read what I wrote, or you wouldn't have bothered to try to convince me of the connection between Church & State, which I already said was definite and clear.
 
I'm agnostic, so a fence sitter by nature lol
I am also for abolishing political parties and voting on individuals because I believe what a random person in US history said regarding them, that political parties serve to 1 - divide the people and 2 - keep a small number of men in power. The only thing I would add for our times is that it is a small number of men and women in power.
I believe that republican and democrat as well as liberal and conservatives are less ideals anymore but rather smokescreens to keep the people fighting among themselves and ignoring what the Government is doing which, at this point, is basically nothing except collecting paychecks.
I also don't believe we are a fairly represented Republic any longer and haven't been since we voted in the cap on the number of representatives we can have.
I don't think 535 people can fairly represent around 327 million people even if it was their best intention to do so (and I find this rather doubtful as well).
I am also of the unpopular opinion of one person one vote period. Do away with the electorial college, do away with districts and simply tally up the votes of the American Citizens when voting on anything. In other words, a true democracy.
Then the people get what they deserve be it for ill or for good.

Religiously I find the whole discussion moot. If there is a Biblical God then He created me to question everything, thusly making it impossible to follow anything on blind faith. Therefore the Biblical God doomed me from the beginning.
I rather like the idea of the great wheel and we just do it over and over again until we gain the enlightenment we should gain and "move on" but that is probably because one of my favorite books I've read in recent years was "Reincarnation Blues"

So there you go my weirdness of beliefs or lack thereof in a nutshell.
 
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