LMAO I'm so dumb? I've just given you pointers on debate technique that you failed to understand and you think I'm dumb. 🤣 🤣 🤣
In reality, you're backing out of a losing argument because you realise you can't win it. Sad really.
Can kids become transgender ?
- Thread starter JosephTheMainMan
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In reality, you're backing out of a losing argument because you realise you can't win it. Sad really.
Well I see this is a shitshow 😭
Here’s my independent stance:
- Chemical / medical procedures should not be used for children under 18 I think that’s ethically wrong and also children do not have the full brain capacity to make that decision for themselves, just like drug ages or anything else like that, once you’re an adult have at it. I’ve seen countless times of children regretting it years after and there’s no going back.
- It should never be persuaded / forced to be learned by children about this in classes, I never learned this, if they truly believe they want to change they have access to the internet but classroom instruction should not be “politicalized”-this can go in effect for a bunch of topics too that parents may not want them to be taught that in school. Although if it is instructed correctly from unbiased way then maybe but I think people can research on their own.
- BIOLOGICAL MALES should not be in WOMENS SPORTS!
It can be based on the testosterone counts or whatever they are using to determine that. People should not get a scientifically advantage by that it should always be based on biological gender.
- trans people usually have higher chances of suicide so I think people should not judge each other and be respectful of their choice, at least do not spread hate.
- The two gender stuff- this might be me but if you’re going to become trans switch genders I think is fine- just when people start identifying themselves as like cats (I’ve seen this)- that is just quite frankly weird lol… this is the “wOkEnEsS” that does not help anyone including them.
- do not throw political messages around at people. It doesn’t help anyone, I think it will worsen the look of transgenders at this point in time. If people like myself have an opinion to themselves and does not affect them personally (which is like 98% of people I assume) then do not engage as people wanna be left alone. So in short just do not hate on other people for their choice and leave people that don’t want to be involved out of it.
Ye dont yell at me plz be civil if you don’t agree and accept everyone else’s positions < 3
Here’s my independent stance:
- Chemical / medical procedures should not be used for children under 18 I think that’s ethically wrong and also children do not have the full brain capacity to make that decision for themselves, just like drug ages or anything else like that, once you’re an adult have at it. I’ve seen countless times of children regretting it years after and there’s no going back.
- It should never be persuaded / forced to be learned by children about this in classes, I never learned this, if they truly believe they want to change they have access to the internet but classroom instruction should not be “politicalized”-this can go in effect for a bunch of topics too that parents may not want them to be taught that in school. Although if it is instructed correctly from unbiased way then maybe but I think people can research on their own.
- BIOLOGICAL MALES should not be in WOMENS SPORTS!
It can be based on the testosterone counts or whatever they are using to determine that. People should not get a scientifically advantage by that it should always be based on biological gender.
- trans people usually have higher chances of suicide so I think people should not judge each other and be respectful of their choice, at least do not spread hate.
- The two gender stuff- this might be me but if you’re going to become trans switch genders I think is fine- just when people start identifying themselves as like cats (I’ve seen this)- that is just quite frankly weird lol… this is the “wOkEnEsS” that does not help anyone including them.
- do not throw political messages around at people. It doesn’t help anyone, I think it will worsen the look of transgenders at this point in time. If people like myself have an opinion to themselves and does not affect them personally (which is like 98% of people I assume) then do not engage as people wanna be left alone. So in short just do not hate on other people for their choice and leave people that don’t want to be involved out of it.
Ye dont yell at me plz be civil if you don’t agree and accept everyone else’s positions < 3
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
I'll take it as read that you're just not capable of holding a reasoned debate then. 👍
DarthErica
Banned
Heathen2002
Banned
not acting at all ;-)
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
I have had debates. Online and in real life.
I am fully capable with having reasonable debates with actual people.
It's just a lot more difficult when I have to debate a brain dead idiot.
There is no difference between trying to argue with you and a brick wall.
You can't just make assumptions.
Ah argumentum ad hominem. The last resort of the desperately outclassed debater. 🤣 🤣 🤣
She destroyed you lol. You very clearly are not capable of having reasonable debates with anyone.
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
Just because you type more, doesn't make your point anymore valid.
I have a lot more stuff going on than to spend every evening arguing with people over the Internet for a political and religious problem.
So that's why I am going to cut it here, I have more important **** to do.
Especially more important than arguing with you two.
As I said, you're not capable of having a reasoned debate.
Heathen2002
Banned
and you antagonise rather than debate, so technically you are not arguing....but if you were and you identify your sparring partner as a brick wall and you continue to antagonise/debate, doesn't put you in a glowing light now does it bread?
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
Don't you start with falsely accusing me of being another user.
I have been told who Bread is and I don't want to be affiliated with that.
Well he uses pretty much the same arguments based on bigotry so you're affiliated by that.
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
He is straight up accusing me of being him.
I won't tolerate that - make your blank allegations with someone else.
It's a real scummy thing to make accusations against people online.
Especially if those accusations could cause long term effect.
I won't tolerate having people lie about me.
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
Yes.
It means allegations with no evidence or reason.
Hence, it is blank as it has no strength to it.
Not in any standard English dictionary I've seen. You can say false allegations, that works grammatically but blank allegations? Nope.
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
It may not be grammatical and English isn't my first language.
But for the times when I speak English in real life, I have used that term.
People seem to understand what it means.
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
Most of my day is speaking Welsh.
A cool language - one of the oldest in Europe.
English is only online or with people from England.
My native language is Gaelic. I've spoken English all of my life though.
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
Hi, hello. What is the long term effect of being accused of being another user on a chat site? Asking for a friend.
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
It has already been spread so that other staff members are calling me Bread when it started with one staff member. It spreads fast and it's uncontrollable.
This could spread to other users and cause mass harassment against someone over a false accusation (yay correct grammar) - I haven't got to point out the effects of online harassment against people. Because history has shown us how much damage false accusations can do.
Well they both have Celtic roots...
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Deleted member 304437
Guest
According to Medical books human guys have Nipples because as fetus is forming before it develops gender it’s a female like mother then as fetus gets bigger it is given chromosomes that help it become guy or girl and if you get guy then you don’t get breasts but rather boobs so technically we all start as female in gender it’s just as we age we become who we are before being born
DarthErica
Banned
Yep. It just takes the Y chromosome at the right developmental stage to turn the fetus from female to male
Why are you so obsessed with gender and sexuality?
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Deleted member 304335
Guest
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
I don't know how to tell you this, but there's more that goes into your identity than biology and chromosomal makeup.
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
Nahhh... nothing that you can control anyway.
Krypt Tag
Member
No there's not if I wanted to become a dog. I can drink from a bowl all I want and I can piss outside all I want but that doesn't make me a dog. even if got surgery to get a tail and walked on all fours and barked. stuck fur all over me. I will never and can never be a dog.
If you want to say your a girl. then say it but stop denying basic logic and facts
Krypt Tag
Member
Cause H.R. PufnStuff is based
Using both basic logical facts and logic, I can confidently say that there's more involved in someone's identity than biology and chromosomal makeup. Is that part of it? Sure, but not all of it. @Meowz GA's post was about who has a say in your identity, and the only person that does is you. Do you identify masculine or feminine? Do you identify as a jock or a nerd? Biology has influence on some parts of your identity, like your fingerprints for example, but there's so much more that makes you uniquely you. And it's not up to society or your friends or your family to decide who you are.
Krypt Tag
Member
I agree partly. I'm just saying i'm a gay man that's my choice to be gay. if somebody hates me for that. good for them. I should not be upset if somebody hates me for it. that's their choice of thought. that's the same with trans people. if they want to be a man or women. they can do that all they want. good for them but if somebody hates them for it and again they choose to become trans so why do they complain or care if somebody doesn't agree with them or hates on them.
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Deleted member 304437
Guest
Always remember it starts with banning abortion then banning gays then banning trans then banning lgbtq then banning men’s rights and then children’s rights once government tells us what we can do with bodies is when liberty Has truely died
Thank you for your reply. You have an interesting choice of words that I'm curious about. You say that it's your choice to be gay... Do you feel that sexual orientation is a choice? In example, do you believe you could and would truly be straight if you chose to be?
Krypt Tag
Member
personally yes. I'm sure everybody is different but me myself I could choose to be straight if i wanted to be yes.
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
It actually isn't a troll post.
I was very serious about this debate - and I wanted to know what people on this site thought of the situation. Due to its latest increase.
I am very serious about everything i say.
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
Mens rights will never be removed. It will never get that far.
Banning abortion saves the lives of babies.
There is no state in the US or UK that bans gays.
In fact, gay people are more approved than straight people.
JosephTheMainMan
Active Member
Based.
I fully agree with this take.
Adults can do what they want because they are grown people.
However, they cannot force everyone to play along with their game.
I think this outlines a stark difference in beliefs that is pretty noteworthy;
Different beliefs on sexual orientation:
- Sexual orientation is a choice. So someone can choose to be gay, straight, etc. Because this is a choice, it is something that can be criticized or disagreed with.
- Sexual orientation is not a choice, it is something you are born with. So someone is born gay, straight, etc. and they cannot change that. Because this isn't a choice, it is considered discrimination when one sexual orientation has unjust or prejudicial treatment over another.
- Gender identity is a choice. So someone can choose to identify as a man, a woman, etc. Because this is a choice, it is something that can be criticized or disagreed with.
- Gender identity is not a choice, it is something you are born with. So someone is born with the gender identity of a man, a woman, etc. (that doesn't necessarily correspond with their assigned sex at birth, but absolutely can and often does) and they cannot change that. Because this isn't a choice, it is considered discrimination when one gender identity has unjust or prejudicial treatment over another. For definition's sake, people who have a gender identity that corresponds with their assigned sex at birth are cisgender and people who have a gender identity that does not correspond with their assigned sex at birth are transgender.
- Gender identity isn't real; gender and sex are the exact same thing. People are the gender that corresponds with their assigned sex at birth, and people cannot or should not identify otherwise. Transgender men are actually women and transgender women are actually men, and they should be treated as such.
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Deleted member 304335
Guest
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Deleted member 303751
Guest
The world was a much better place before people started to believe that sexuality, gender, pronouns are an achievement hence when they were not forcing it onto everyone else especially children. A discussion about lgbt is sexual because lgbt obviously means their sexuality and it's not a discussion young children should be engaging in. 'It's nobody else's business ' yeah that includes children and they make it our business by forcing it onto them. It's not straight people telling everyone their sexuality, pronouns, demanding validation. Brainwashing children into thinking they are in the 'wrong body' and then making huge profits when they go on puberty blockers 'and for many' body mutilation is huge business follow the money. Children's rights are human rights, puberty is a basic human right for children they cannot consent to puberty blockers.The sexual kinks of adults are being forced onto children to validate the adults. Many 'transgenders' are autogynophiles. The number of children saying they are trans has skyrocketed it's not adults saying they are trans it's basically gay and autistic children being socially coerced to become trans, it's a social contagion.
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Deleted member 303751
Guest
Of course emileh and others will say my comments are 'transphobic' 'bigotry' etc they equate opposing children being sexualised, brainwashed with gender ideology, opposing womens rights being destroyed etc as 'transphobic' 'hatred' 'bigotry ' and that's worse and more dangerous than actual bigotry. Basically they are intolerant of anyone who has a different view and that in itself is a form of bigotry, they are either brainwashed by woke bs, they are coward virtue signallers or just stupid.
Well yeasted one, you took the words right out of my mouth with the first part of that last post. I'm not intolerant of different views though, I'm intolerant of intolerance which is why I bother to respond and refute your nasty intolerant small minded posts.
All anyone has to do is scroll back through this thread and they'll find a post where I methodically demolished your entire argument one step at a time. Like I said there, you don't bother fact checking or applying a bit of critical thinking to your sources, you just find ones that reinforce your small minded world view when they're actually so much bullshite.
All anyone has to do is scroll back through this thread and they'll find a post where I methodically demolished your entire argument one step at a time. Like I said there, you don't bother fact checking or applying a bit of critical thinking to your sources, you just find ones that reinforce your small minded world view when they're actually so much bullshite.
I’ve been afraid to seriously comment on this thread when the kids present, so I’ll try to be mild.
I’m not in favor of transitioning on a physical level. I think you can be more effeminate or masculine and everything in between on the spectrum, despite your sex
The real issue with a lot of these topics is the ignorance of sex and gender…
FYI, thousands of years of history might back the idea that gender spectrum exists. I just find it sad everyone jumps to the topic of physical transitions.
I’m not in favor of transitioning on a physical level. I think you can be more effeminate or masculine and everything in between on the spectrum, despite your sex
The real issue with a lot of these topics is the ignorance of sex and gender…
FYI, thousands of years of history might back the idea that gender spectrum exists. I just find it sad everyone jumps to the topic of physical transitions.
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Deleted member 303751
Guest
Well deluded one good to know you admit you equate opposing the sexualisation and indoctrination of children, opposing womens rights being destroyed with bigotry. Are you on drugs or just in cukoo land perpetually? You said quote ' All anyone has to do is scroll back through this thread and they'll find a post where I methodically demolished your entire argument one step at a time'. Only in your deluded head you did because this is only my third post in this thread hence my very first post in this thread was 17 minutes prior to your reply. You made yourself look very stupid once again but that's par for the course with you.
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Deleted member 303751
Guest
Emileh instead of telling lies as you clearly did with your previous post why don't you 'methodically demolish my argument 'above' one step at a time. Try doing it without regurgitating your usual nonsense I.e playing the bigotry card
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Deleted member 303751
Guest
Emileh lol you lost
DarthErica
Banned
Krypt Tag
Member
That's stupid don't you know pigeons are one of the smartest animals on this planet lmao
DarthErica
Banned
True, maybe I shoulda said cockroach instead
Cockroaches like bread too.
DarthErica
Banned
Perhaps flies then since they’re attracted to sh!t 😂😂
DarthErica
Banned
Or a starfish lol 😂
Ataraxia
Member
as a kid who's transgender, yes we can 🥰🥰🥰
zozoooooooooooo
Active Member
no anyone under 18 shouldn't be able to make that choice
Ataraxia
Member
if it was a real problem, then it would be illegal 🥰 and i assume you're talking about transmed, meaning someone who medically transitions with surgery. kids who are trans usually only change their appearance and/or change their name. it's very very very rare for children to medically transition before the age of 18
I think you're conflating transgender with transitioning. Anyone is free to choose to identify as the gender of their choice. Young people don't transition untill they're legally adult except in very rare circumstances. What they do do is live as the gender of their choice.
Good catch! They wrote it backwards to their intent, I think. I believe they meant, "no on under 18 should be able." The double negative though makes it "everyone under 18 should be able," because if no one shouldn't, then everyone should.
Yeah lol, I saw it earlier and just thought "that's a weird way of talking" then others replied and was like "oh wait... wait, no thats not right"
Well, maybe they meant what they said, guess we'll see
DarthErica
Banned
So what exactly is your point?
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Deleted member 263960
Guest
According to this article, in Canada - children "are assisted into transitioning" https://www.cbc.ca/news/health/gender-affirming-care-youth-1.7021529 which seems to include procedures that are supportive up to and including surgery - article says rare* for under 18 but not illegal even for pre puberty.
Trans youth are fighting for increased ability to transition as minors in that same article.
According to this (albiet right wing publication) the PM Of Canada the Rt Honourable Trudeau is quoted/ deeming "parental rights" in relation to trans children- as "far right ideology" https://nationalpost.com/opinion/mi...rudeau-dismisses-parental-rights-as-far-right
And here: 14 yo with "demonstrated maturity" transition at age 14 in Manitoba https://nationalpost.com/news/canada/who-gets-to-decide-when-a-14-year-old-wants-to-change-gender
Ataraxia
Member
As I said it is very rare for this to happen, and most surgeons (here in the us at least) won't do these kinds of surgeries on minors. I do agree that kids should wait to have these kinds of surgeries until their 18 though as they're pretty invasive and have a long recovery process. However, the act of being transgender doesn't require medical transition, so technically yes kids can be transgender
avery041234
New Member
i feel yes, and only my opinion... so plz don't take this the wrong way, we can accept religion???? but no change social norms???
I can't speak for Canada but in the UK that's not the case. There was an initial issue with puberty blockers but the UK Government has issued stricter guidelines on their use.
She actually said
It's the lack of punctuation that makes it unclear. If a comma had been used you'd have "no, anyone under 18 shouldn't be able to make that choice" which makes more sense.
I'm 100% certain that said no-one originally. But eh 🤷♀️ not really that important, maybe just me no read good
I’d like to hear from more trans people on this subject, including trans teens or parents of trans kids.
I’d also like to see stats of the number of “kids” (under 18s) that have had surgery and the details of those.
Without that ^^ we’re in the same boat as a bunch of middle-aged upper-class white folk talking about race relations, ie. We can have an opinion but it’s ill-informed and on a subject that (a) we know little about, (b) don’t fully understand, and (c) we don’t have experience of
I’d also like to see stats of the number of “kids” (under 18s) that have had surgery and the details of those.
Without that ^^ we’re in the same boat as a bunch of middle-aged upper-class white folk talking about race relations, ie. We can have an opinion but it’s ill-informed and on a subject that (a) we know little about, (b) don’t fully understand, and (c) we don’t have experience of
zozoooooooooooo
Active Member
erm children shouldn't be able to decide if their trans or not
That shows a grotesque lack of understanding and perhaps you should inform yourself on the subject before commenting on it
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Deleted member 263960
Guest
Hundreds of trans teens under 18 have had breasts removed in Canada, new data show
Concerns have been raised about mastectomies in teens when uncertainties exist about long-term health effects and the possibility of regret
nationalpost.com
"Of the 4,071 visits in total involving gender-affirming mastectomies or breast reductions reported since 2018, 602 involved youth 18 and under.
Of those, 303 involved teens 17 and younger. The youngest age was 14."
Canadian surgeons performing mastectomies on trans teens as young as 14
Mastectomies are meant to alleviate chest dysphoria from unwanted breasts. A parents' group wants the surgeries banned in minors.
nationalpost.com
zozoooooooooooo
Active Member
it's my opinion
Founded on a ridiculous notion that anyone chooses to be transgender
zozoooooooooooo
Active Member
i mean being trans is becoming a trend atp, children do it to try and fit in
And if they do then it's a trend and will pass when they get bored with it. So what?
zozoooooooooooo
Active Member
LMAOOO, my point is its stupid
602 18 and under very quickly halves when you take out the 18-year olds. I notice they don’t list it by age any further than saying the youngest was 14.Hundreds of trans teens under 18 have had breasts removed in Canada, new data show
Concerns have been raised about mastectomies in teens when uncertainties exist about long-term health effects and the possibility of regret
"Of the 4,071 visits in total involving gender-affirming mastectomies or breast reductions reported since 2018, 602 involved youth 18 and under.
Of those, 303 involved teens 17 and younger. The youngest age was 14."
Canadian surgeons performing mastectomies on trans teens as young as 14
Mastectomies are meant to alleviate chest dysphoria from unwanted breasts. A parents' group wants the surgeries banned in minors.
So we’re looking at 60 teens a year and all we know is that they’re either. 14, 15, 16, or 17. We don’t know what their general health, specifically their mental health, was like before that surgery or what the trajectory of it would be like had they not had it.
I’m not coming down on either side of this argument because I wasn’t a trans teen and I’m not the parent of a teenager who’s going through it - but for those who say “it shouldn’t be allowed”, I’d encourage restraint on having an opinion if there is no immediate experience of it
If you think that, you really should probably get your head checked. Nobody is going to undergo such surgery just to “fit in” to a minority. This is the problem with the internet, everyone thinks they’re an expert when mostly they’re talking out of their bottoms
zozoooooooooooo
Active Member
am i talking bout the surgery?
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Deleted member 263960
Guest
NP, im not on sides either just trying to provide some sort of stats that you mentioned. ILl check Stats Canada and see if they break it down more
Much like you, I don’t know what you’re talking about
My point is if they want to be "stupid" then it's nobody's business but theirs.
It's not stupidity by the way, it's experimentation and that's a healthy part of growing up.
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Deleted member 303751
Guest
It destroys their body it makes them sterlie for life, it basically makes them dependent on drugs for life, it puts them or their parents into debt paying for puberty blockers, drugs and in many cases body mutilation when they absolutely do not need that. Children's rights are human rights, puberty is a basic human right for children they cannot consent to puberty blockers.
If a child has anorexia and thinks they are fat they don't get liposuction they don't get surgery they get help with their mental health. Gender dysphoria is a mental illness it should not be promoted and celebrated. Self acceptance is better than self delusion but of course the profit is in the latter it's huge business follow the money.
Imagine being a parent and your son comes home from school with blue hair saying his name is now Jessica "or any girls name" and demands to go on puberty blockers and then body mutilation because he now identifies as female them if the parent refuses he gets called names '"transphobe" "bigot" etc it's being forced onto children's the numbers have skyrocketed it's basically a form of conversion therapy they are manufacturing children to be trans it's a disgrace.
And there we have
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Deleted member 303751
Guest
Children are only kids for a short time they are adults for most of their life for about 60 years they are adults so what's the rush to get them on puberty blockers and then body mutilation? The people pushing this agenda know that children are easily manipulated it's why they are being targeted and brainwashed with gender ideology nonsense. The very same people who say "we support you" "your part of our community " turn their backs on them, mock them, ridicule them and treat them like shi t when they de transition.
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Deleted member 303751
Guest
By the way blue hair you should look into the new ban on 'conversion therapy' law they are trying to push through in Scotland it includes "suppressing gender identity " if the law is passed parents who don't allow their own children to change gender, go on puberty blockers will be jailed for 7 years. Senior legal communications officer ,ADF Lois Mclatchie spoke out against it on GB news free speech nation episode 14th January. Watch it on y outube if you want fast forward to 1 hour 43 minutes.
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Deleted member 303751
Guest
The fact they are even TRYING to push that law through exposes their agenda
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